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Received this in today's newsletter

https://support.bidorbuy.co.za/Knowledgebase/Article/View/245/5/secure-citizen?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=sellers&utm_term=January_2022

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Seeds and All

Check out their privacy policy under "Information Collected". We may collect store and transfer your personal information... for the following purposes:

...Direct marketing, newsletter or support subscriptions.

...Contest entries or survey participation.

 

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Craig
2 hours ago, Seeds and All said:

Check out their privacy policy under "Information Collected". We may collect store and transfer your personal information... for the following purposes:

...Direct marketing, newsletter or support subscriptions.

...Contest entries or survey participation.

 

The required consent in relation to Secure Citizen processing your personal information is for the sole purpose of verifying your identity. Secure Citizen is required to have a privacy policy that may cover scenarios that fall outside our relationship with them.

bidorbuy does not pass on any contact information like phone numbers or email addresses for this purpose so you can rest assured that you will not be signing up for any marketing etc. bidorbuy also does not capture your biometrics ourselves. This is handled by Secure Citizen.

The move to implement this service is there to protect Buyers but also Sellers from unauthorised access and other activity. It also allows us to remove the need to request sensitive document like ID documents from our Sellers in the future.

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Dazzling Delights

Below is what you consent to with this company being allowed to collect all sorts of personal information and able to use it for a whole range of purposes, any of which are very ambiguous and gives them very open-ended ways that they can use your personal information.

To trust a pretty new company (only registered 2019) who feels the need to hide their own information (https://www.whois.com/whois/securecitizen.co.za) so that a person does not know the details of this companies domain registration, with such sensitive information, stored on their servers which could be hacked and very sensitive personal information be stolen (we have no idea of what security measures this company has in place to protect our information, many larger companies than this have fallen victim to hacks and have had clients information stolen). No thank you. 

Sorry but the terms of this company and what they can collect and use my personal information for, and the risk of extremely sensitive information being stored/leaked from their servers. This is an absolute NO. I have already verified myself with Bid or Buy by providing copies of my identity documents as well as proof of residence documents. Bid or Buy has a habit of not listening to it's clients, just look at the debacle of the new and horrible website format shoved down our throats. This is one step too far and is NOT worth the risk with such sensitive information. Force this down our throats and you will be saying goodbye to A LOT of sellers, myself included. I have paid to Bid or Buy over the past year R126712.72 (One Hundred and Twenty Six Thousand, Seven Hundred and Twelve Rands and Seventy Two Cents). Implement this and you may say goodbye to that money for the next year and the years to follow. I will use that money to have my own website designed and will take my Bid or Buy customer database with me. I will pay far less in fees than I pay to Bid or Buy!!! The only loser here will be Bid or Buy!!!

See below what you will be agreeing to and what will be collected by this company and the myriad ways that they will be using your information, with some particularly disturbing sections in bold and italic!!!

 

 

Your Consent and Agreement

By accessing this website and accepting these terms:

  • You consent to the collection, storage, use and transfer of your personal information, which includes if applicable your biometric data for processing as described in this privacy policy; and
  • You further agree that you have read, understood and accept the terms and conditions of this privacy policy and our terms of use.

We reserve the right to change our Privacy Policy as necessity dictates. Continued use of this website and/or related services implies acceptance of this Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use, as updated from time to time.

All disputes over privacy and your data shall be governed as set out in this Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use.

What is personal information?

Personal and Special Personal information is information which identifies you as an individual, and includes:

  • your biometric information;
  • your name if it appears with your other personal information or if your name itself would reveal information about you;
  • information relating to your gender, marital status, national origin, age, language and birth;
  • information relating to your education, criminal or employment history;
  • any identifying number symbol, e-mail address, physical address, telephone number, location information, online identifier or other particular assignment to you;
  • any other information defined as “Personal Information” or “Special Personal Information” in terms of the Protection of Personal Information Act 4 of 2013 (“POPI”); and

Information collected

We may collect your personal information through your access and use of this website, applications,  during conversations or correspondence with Secure Citizen’s representatives, or when you use our services.

We may collect, store and transfer personal information from you in connection with and for the following purposes:

  • Know Your Customer (KYC) requirements;
  • Anti-Money Laundering and/or Counter Terrorism Financing Legislation, Rules and Regulations, as relevant to your country;
  • Financial Intelligence Centre Act 38 of 2001 legislation, as amended (FICA);
  • Regulation of Interception of Communications and Provision of Communication-Related Information Act 70 of 2002 legislation, as amended (RICA);
  • The provision of any product or service that Secure Citizen and/or our affiliates may offer now or in the future;
  • Orders, activations, and registrations for any services;
  • Creation of a user profile as a registered Secure Citizen and verification of such profile;
  • Information requests or complaints;
  • Direct marketing, newsletter or support subscriptions;
  • Contest entries or survey participation; and
  • Employment applications.
  • To reduce identity fraud

We may collect, store and transfer the following types of personal information and special personal information, including, but not limited to:

  • Personal and business contact information, such as name, address, telephone number, and email address;
  • Biometric information;
  • All information and documentation required in terms of Anti-Money Laundering and/or Counter Terrorism Financing Legislation, Rules and Regulations, as relevant to your country;
  • All information and documentation required in terms of FICA;
  • All information and documentation required in terms of RICA;
  • All information and documentation required in terms of other legal and/or business requirements relating to KYC;
  • Other unique information such as user IDs and passwords, product functionality, product and service preferences, contact preferences, educational and employment history;
  • Any information necessary in order for us to provide the services you have requested;
  • Geo-location information such as your  physical location;
  • Details of the services that you subscribed for or which you have enquired about, together with any additional information necessary the provision of  those services and to respond to your enquiries;
  • Any additional information relating to you that you provide to us.

We may store your personal information manually or electronically. By registering as a registered Secure Citizen, you also expressly consent to receive direct marketing from us about goods or services offered by Secure Citizen and any other affiliate, or entity within Secure Citizen and their group of companies.   

BY SUPPLYING YOUR PERSONAL INFORMATION AND USING THE SECURE CITIZEN WEBSITE AND/OR RELATED SERVICES, YOU CONSENT TO THE COLLECTION, STORAGE, USE AND TRANSFER OF YOUR PERSONAL INFORMATION, WHICH INCLUDES YOUR BIOMETRIC DATA.

How the information collected is used

Personal information is provided to Secure Citizen,  by you and will only be used for the purposes for which it was provided as well as for the purposes listed in this Privacy Policy. In light of the nature of the services we offer, we may share your information with our third-party service providers in order to provide our services to you. In the provision of the services, we may also allow other users to access your personal information, provided you have agreed to any such user being granted access. Personal information will not be sold to third parties, or provided to direct marketing companies or other such organisations without your permission. We may disclose your personal information to third parties if we are under a duty to disclose or share such information in order to comply with any legal obligation or to protect the rights, property or safety of the Companies, its clients or any other person.

We may use your information to:

  • Provide you with the services, this may also necessitate the sharing your personal information with our third-party service providers located in South Africa as well as outside of South Africa;
  • Provide third parties with your KYC formation, biometrics and documentation for the purposes of validating and verifying your identity;
  • Manage our relationship with you and the service providers;
  • Provide you with access to protected areas of our website;
  • Communicate with you about our services or support as well as that of our affiliates and service providers and send marketing communications in connection therewith;
  • Provide support to you in respect of the services;
  • Improve our services and develop new services;
  • Provide personalised promotional offers;
  • To allow you to participate in interactive features of our service;
  • Measure performance of marketing initiatives;
  • Allow you to participate in contests and surveys;
  • Answer enquiries, provide information, support or advice about existing and new products or services;
  • Assess and improve the performance and operation of the website;
  • To keep your contact details up to date and provide you with updates;
  • Prevent and detect security threats, fraud or other malicious activity; and

to process and respond to any complaint made by you.

 

 

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Craig

Hi Everyone, I wanted to provide some feedback here for you. We have been in touch with Secure Citizen and raised the concerns voiced here. They confirmed that their privacy policy was drafted to cater for other applications outside of what our usage requires. They will be reviewing this to be more clear.

bidorbuy has also updated our wording so you are absolutely clear what you are consenting to if ever prompted to verify your identity:

Quote

If you proceed, you consent to Secure Citizen processing your personal information and communicating with you for the purpose of verifying your identity. bidorbuy will pass on to Secure Citizen your identification number. No other personal information is sent by bidorbuy to Secure Citizen. You will be required to complete facial biometric matching via a "selfie" which is captured by Secure Citizen and verified against your image that is housed at the Department of Home Affairs. All transactions processed through Secure Citizen are encrypted. For more information, please visit www.securecitizen.co.za and www.safps.org.za.

Secure Citizen is part-owned by SAFPS, which is the leader in fraud-prevention in South Africa. Every major financial institution in South Africa together with most major retailers in South Africa are members, working together to protect consumers. The institutions we are dealing with are sound and reputable.

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Seeds and All
20 hours ago, Craig said:

Hi Everyone, I wanted to provide some feedback here for you. We have been in touch with Secure Citizen and raised the concerns voiced here. They confirmed that their privacy policy was drafted to cater for other applications outside of what our usage requires. They will be reviewing this to be more clear.

bidorbuy has also updated our wording so you are absolutely clear what you are consenting to if ever prompted to verify your identity:

Secure Citizen is part-owned by SAFPS, which is the leader in fraud-prevention in South Africa. Every major financial institution in South Africa together with most major retailers in South Africa are members, working together to protect consumers. The institutions we are dealing with are sound and reputable.

Thank you Craig for listening to our concerns. Please update us here when Secure Citizen has updated their Privacy Policy and we'll gladly participate.

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Dazzling Delights

There has been no update of the terms and conditions set out by Secure Citizen, terms which we must agree to in order to process this new nonsense "verification". Yet Bid or Buy have started implementing this nonsense already. The terms which we must agree to are completely unacceptable. Bid or Buy can state as much as they want that none of these terms apply to us, the fact of the matter is that these terms DO apply to us as we cannot proceed without AGREEING TO THESE TERMS!!!

The notion that we are "safe" because SAFPS is apparently "sound and reputable" will be very quickly dispelled by a quick Google search for "SAFPS Reviews". Horror stories about about how this "sound and reputable" organization have ruined innocent people's lives. Do the search yourself and decide if this is company you are willing to trust with such sensitive information such as your biometrics and more.

 

Bid or Buy @Craig why has this been implemented with no change to the terms and conditions which we need to accept at Secure Citizen? You assured us, falsely obviously, that the terms would be updated. The terms as they stand currently are unacceptable as it gives far too much power over our personal data and extremely sensitive biometric data. It allows to store (on servers which can be hacked) and even allows them to transfer our biometric data (where to? who knows, the terms allow them to transfer our data anywhere they wish). You cannot say that the terms "do not apply to us" because by forcing us to agree to such terms, they automatically DO apply to us. As the terms stand, there is no chance in hell that I am giving my data up to this company who has such bad reviews.

Obviously Bid or Buy do not need my yearly R120000+ in fees, therefore I will take those fees elsewhere and will start my own website unless Bid or Buy puts aside this nonsense until such time as the terms we are forced to agree to are updated as Bid or Buy assured us that they would be. I will take the customer database which I have gained from my sales here and send those clients to my own website.

 

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Craig

Hi @Dazzling Delights. I checked in with Secure Citizen - they are almost complete with their updated privacy policy. I will update once I have this feedback. Regarding your particular case, I will ask our security team to check on your account as to why it may have flagged your account. I'm sure we can sort it out so you can continue trading without issue. I will provide an update on the Secure Citizen terms once I have something to share.

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Craig

This is a long-overdue reply to your query. Apologies for the long wait. We have engaged with Secure Citizen and raised the concerns brought up here, especially those around direct-marketing referenced in the Secure Citizen policy. Secure Citizen has reviewed their policy and is comfortable that its contents are appropriate for their business needs for consumers who make use of their services.

bidorbuy is using Secure Citizen as a service-provider platform and our users are not using the www.securecitizen.co.za consumer site. The privacy policy there is not applicable to our integration and service. Apologies for any confusion caused by us referencing their customer privacy policy.

The checks we do for the purpose of verifying an identity do not include anything that contains a telephone number or email address (and therefore there is no way to use this info for marketing even if that was the intention). In line with this, our updated consent clause is specific about what we are doing with your data. You will see that we still reference their website which we believe is useful should a user want to read up more about SAFPS and Secure Citizen.

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The use of this technology, we believe, is far better than storing copies of IDs and other documents. It enables us to work with certainty that the person making sensitive changes on a user account is, in fact, authorised to do so. We have found it incredibly effective in keeping our platform and users safe.

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TradeRouteAuctions

@Craig Lately I would say in the last few weeks - I never received the prompt showing Secure-citizen verification.

I thought that check has been removed, because prior to that time I used to get notification at least once a week to verify.

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Craig
12 hours ago, TradeRouteAuctions said:

@Craig Lately I would say in the last few weeks - I never received the prompt showing Secure-citizen verification.

I thought that check has been removed, because prior to that time I used to get notification at least once a week to verify.

@TradeRouteAuctions that should not happen unless certain sensitive changes take place on your account (e.g. your bank account details change). Thank you for the feedback and help with the team in testing this with us.

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TradeRouteAuctions
On 4/29/2022 at 1:15 PM, Craig said:

@TradeRouteAuctions that should not happen unless certain sensitive changes take place on your account (e.g. your bank account details change). Thank you for the feedback and help with the team in testing this with us.

Tried changing bank details from one bank to another - It's no longer prompting to Secure citizen at all.

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