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Ilya2005

Buying uncertified gems

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Ilya2005    10
Ilya2005

Regarding buying "uncertified" gems on BOB: unless you are a trained gemologist...DON'T! Seriously, there is so much synthetic and outright fake material being sold on BOB as genuine, the ONLY gem you should buy is one with a certification from a reputable lab.

 

I've been stuck with gems that are 100% synthetic when the seller has sworn on the grave of his grandmother that the gem in question is all-natural. Frankly, the wolves are among the sheep and are getting plenty to eat.

 

BOB could help the situation as gemrockauctions.com does: there, they have two sections for gems..certified and uncertified. BOB knows there is a problem but, apparently, doesn't care about its buyers getting taken.

 

I'll continue to buy on BOB...but, only from gem sellers whom I trust and only when they sell a gem that has been certified by a reputable lab...such as GISA.

 

Until then, I'll remember the words of my old Grandad who always told me: "One day, a man will come along and bet you $20/US that he can make the Jack of Spades jump out of a deck of cards and spit prune juice. Don't take that bet or you'll end up $20/US lighter...and, with an ear full of prune juice."

 

You have been warned...

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Cali Craft and Gems    10
Cali Craft and Gems

As a gem seller myself, on one hand I understand where you are coming from (I too have been bitten in the past), but your wording casts the shadow over us honest sellers who DO sell the genuine product without the certification to keep the buyer's costs low.

 

I have had a handful of our gems certified, and have sent items away for clients after they have purchased the item and have opted to pay for the certification themselves.

 

If I had to have all (or most) of my gems certified, this would create two problems: firstly I would be severely out of pocket as certification does not come cheap (or quickly), and secondly, I would have to increase my selling prices which would immediately cut out a large portion of my buyers who want "the real thing at a good price".

 

Ultimately it is always the case of buyer beware... It is the buyer's responsibility to do their homework, to read between the lines, and to ask questions. Personally I feel that it is the buyer's choice whether to ask for certification or not, but if they do request certification on a particular gem, if the seller is knowingly being dishonest about the gems authenticity, then surely they would try to avoid following the buyer's request?

 

Just my two cents worth...

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Ilya2005    10
Ilya2005

I understand

 

As a gem seller myself, on one hand I understand where you are coming from (I too have been bitten in the past), but your wording casts the shadow over us honest sellers who DO sell the genuine product without the certification to keep the buyer's costs low.

 

I have had a handful of our gems certified, and have sent items away for clients after they have purchased the item and have opted to pay for the certification themselves.

 

If I had to have all (or most) of my gems certified, this would create two problems: firstly I would be severely out of pocket as certification does not come cheap (or quickly), and secondly, I would have to increase my selling prices which would immediately cut out a large portion of my buyers who want "the real thing at a good price".

 

Ultimately it is always the case of buyer beware... It is the buyer's responsibility to do their homework, to read between the lines, and to ask questions. Personally I feel that it is the buyer's choice whether to ask for certification or not, but if they do request certification on a particular gem, if the seller is knowingly being dishonest about the gems authenticity, then surely they would try to avoid following the buyer's request?

 

Just my two cents worth...

 

I understand. There are reputable sellers on BOB who are honest such as yourself and there are some...quite a few, actually...who aren't. So far, my rate of honest sellers to less-than-honest ones is about fifty-fifty. It's the dishonest sellers who give all sellers a bad name.

 

As for the costs associated with certification and the time it takes to get a gem certified, I justify both those by knowing with a certainty that the gems I set into a ring, brooch, pendant or bracelet for a customer are genuine and have a certification to hand them with their piece of jewelry. When someone is paying R10,000 and up for a piece of fine custom jewelry, the last thing they want to think about is whether or not their stone is genuine. Besides, I factor the cost into the price when I make a custom piece for a client.

 

One dealer with whom I have done business here on BOB sells probably 90% of his gems that have been certified by GISA or another reputable lab. I have learned to give him most of my business. To date, every gem he has sold me...on BOB and in direct sales from him to me without BOB...has been exactly what I, and my clients, expect.

 

My reputation is more important to me than an additional R500 to R800 to have a gem certified or the three weeks +/- in which to have it done.

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musicmanct    10
musicmanct

Oh dear, reading this makes me petrified. I just bought a gem and its in the post right now...:sad:

 

I am crossing fingers for the first time.

 

Hi guys, been a newbie to bob for some time now. I recently won an item and made the payment the same afternoon like always, whenever I win. However the seller has not got back to me at all regarding the win or receipt of payment. Of the 8 items I bought so far, all the sellers acknowledge after the auction closed that I won and the details relating to payments and such. But not this time with this buyer.

 

As this was my larger amount spent, I am getting concerned. Should I worry? :wacko:

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qball    11
qball
Oh dear, reading this makes me petrified. I just bought a gem and its in the post right now...:sad:

 

I am crossing fingers for the first time.

 

Hi guys, been a newbie to bob for some time now. I recently won an item and made the payment the same afternoon like always, whenever I win. However the seller has not got back to me at all regarding the win or receipt of payment. Of the 8 items I bought so far, all the sellers acknowledge after the auction closed that I won and the details relating to payments and such. But not this time with this buyer.

 

As this was my larger amount spent, I am getting concerned. Should I worry? :wacko:

 

Welcome to the forum. Please email hello@bidorbuy.co.za with the seller and order details, we will follow up with them. From what I can see you have bought mostly from Verified Sellers and sellers with good positive ratings. Please check the seller rating first before deciding to buy, see what other buyers say about the seller. This is usually a good indication that they are reliable.

 

P.s. Please do not post in multiple threads. Thanks.

Edited by qball
added text

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musicmanct    10
musicmanct

Thank you, sorry about that, was in a bit of panic so I multi posted and bundled with that the

"newbie" in me coming out :-)

 

Thank you for the advise, I am going to give it today and see on Monday. As you say, they are verified

so I don't have to panic too much. Great stuff.

 

Thanks for the response qball, much appreciated.

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qball    11
qball

My pleasure!:bigsmile:

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SADiamondsrus    10
SADiamondsrus

I am a trained gemologist, and that's thanks to being bitten by suppliers too many times. Sorry you had a bad experience.

 

I now have a handful of suppliers I can trust and business is good :)

 

GISA is GREAT especially for sellers, their prices are very low and makes possible for certification to sell.

 

Goodluck

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Ilya2005    10
Ilya2005
I am a trained gemologist, and that's thanks to being bitten by suppliers too many times. Sorry you had a bad experience.

 

I now have a handful of suppliers I can trust and business is good :)

 

GISA is GREAT especially for sellers, their prices are very low and makes possible for certification to sell.

 

Goodluck

 

Thanks for the response. You and I agree that there are sellers who just want to make a quick profit regardless of whether a gem is real or not. I, too, am a trained gemologist and occasionally have been taken. My trusting nature has been eroded somewhat by these charlatans, so, now I only deal with reputable sellers who sell (mostly) certified gems.

 

Another writer said that buyers would balk at paying for GISA certification...or any other certification...but, I disagree. One of the selling points I employ in selling finished high-end jewelry to my clients is to be able to furnish them with a genuine certification for the gem or gems I used in making their pieces of jewelry. I have yet to meet the buyer who says "I don't care about certification" when several thousand Rand are at stake.

 

I am still chuckling at a response I got from a seller (here on BoB, by the way) when I asked him simply if the Sapphire he was offering was genuine. He danced around the issue in his response telling me about his "reputation" and his "good name". He never did answer my direct question about whether the Sapphire was genuine or not. You can imagine what I did NOT buy from him. :wacko:

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SADiamondsrus    10
SADiamondsrus

Wow, not answering such a direct important question makes for suspicion. I had bought from such a seller with 100% ratings, good name and all, yellow sapphire worth R66000, had it graded, turned out to be treated, and R11 000 in value. Didnt make a fuss, but now know better.

 

99.99% of my clients WANT the certification, its for piece of mind.

 

Its that quick profit, and being shady that will burn them in the long run.

 

All the best

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Ilya2005    10
Ilya2005
Wow, not answering such a direct important question makes for suspicion. I had bought from such a seller with 100% ratings, good name and all, yellow sapphire worth R66000, had it graded, turned out to be treated, and R11 000 in value. Didnt make a fuss, but now know better.

 

99.99% of my clients WANT the certification, its for piece of mind.

 

Its that quick profit, and being shady that will burn them in the long run.

 

All the best

 

 

Sorry to hear about that under-valued and over-promoted Sapphire. I'm not sure I would have been so generous in losing R55,000 in value.

 

Since I live in the States, I haven't known much about GISA. Over the last two years, however, I've purchased quite a few gems from BoB sellers who offer such graded gems. I am impressed at the grading and the total package that is a GISA-graded gem. I can honestly tell a client that the Sapphire I used in her solitaire ring is indeed a genuine Loupe Clean/IF-VVS Sapphire that came with that GISA cert. It made the difference in being able to price that ring at about triple what I paid for the Sapphire as well as being able to sleep at night. :bigsmile:

 

Continued success in your gem business. I'll have to take a look at your offerings.

 

Best from...

 

Ilya2005

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SADiamondsrus    10
SADiamondsrus

Thank you, very kind of you. Thing is, I even believe its HARD to find a R11000 value gem for the R1100 I paid for, so re-selling it for R3000 still gives my buyer a great gem and great value, and I smile with 200% profit. And the seller is really great, just over estimates his gems.

 

Luke at GISA is great, I stil plan to buy 10-20 gems to utilise him again, compared to other labs, his prices are good for a mini report+value+pic :)

 

Thank you, I mainly sell diamonds and moissanite rings now, my gosh the beauty of such moissanite rings is breath taking! And all stones come from Charles+colvard USA, stunning. Lol I am selling here.

 

Do you sell in USA?

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Ilya2005    10
Ilya2005
Thank you, very kind of you. Thing is, I even believe its HARD to find a R11000 value gem for the R1100 I paid for, so re-selling it for R3000 still gives my buyer a great gem and great value, and I smile with 200% profit. And the seller is really great, just over estimates his gems.

 

Luke at GISA is great, I stil plan to buy 10-20 gems to utilise him again, compared to other labs, his prices are good for a mini report+value+pic :)

 

Thank you, I mainly sell diamonds and moissanite rings now, my gosh the beauty of such moissanite rings is breath taking! And all stones come from Charles+colvard USA, stunning. Lol I am selling here.

 

Do you sell in USA?

 

Yes, I do sell in the US. I am a jewelry designer who takes the gems I buy and fashions them into exquisite rings, brooches, earrings and bracelets. The rings are mostly for women but I do have many men as clients. However, I do occasionally buy just for my own gem portfolio. I like the upside to a fine gem in FL/Loupe Clean clarity, with certification. Lately, more and more of my clients seem to be seeking certified unheated and untreated gems. That's pretty much where I am in inventory, as well.

 

Last month, I happened across a VVS Pink/Padparadscha oval/mixed cut Sapphire at 9.63 carats, certified unheated and the seller was asking what a heated gem of the same size would fetch. Naturally, I bought it, sent it to GIA in New York who confirmed the original certification as unheated with a valuation of about triple what I paid for it.. That one went right into the private portfolio. :whistling:

 

Some of the prices on BoB are closer to retail than wholesale or I would buy more. I do have favorite sellers on BoB who offer quality gems and aren't afraid to work with me on price. I understand the profit margin may be thinner for some sellers than others, so, I just ask nicely and, from time to time, a seller will cut the price a little. He still makes a profit and I have a little more margin for myself. Everybody wins. :awesome:

 

Your Moissanite gems are breath-taking. I'm still just dealing in colored gems...no diamonds...because the diamond trade is a step above my "pay grade". They are nice, though. Since you're in SA, are diamonds more reasonably-priced there or easier to obtain?

 

Have a great day!

 

Ilya2005

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SADiamondsrus    10
SADiamondsrus

Hi!

 

Sorry I totally missed the post ! What a luck RE "Last month, I happened across a VVS Pink/Padparadscha oval/mixed cut Sapphire at 9.63 carats" !! Well done. I am sure if I had just a little more time (3 kiddies under 6) I would love to offer gemstones....I feel though, even though I studied, gemstones I still have a lot to learn.

 

Yes, I invested all my savings getting into the diamond side. Oh the moissanites are stunning and in my opinion better than diamonds.... they sparkle from across the room :)

 

There is one particular seller I love on BOB that provides good gemstones, although his retail value is a bit far out, my investment is 10x less the actual retail.

 

Other than selling diamonds and moissanite jewellery, I also create gemstone jewellery with pieces brought in by clients.

 

 

I must be honest, I import all my diamonds and then sell them. I have 2 very good suppliers who I too squeeze for a deal (I however negotiate every deal) and prefer laser drilled enhancements (Permanent enhancement) , because I get a great diamond in all C's, and my clients are happy with the CE as they get a great stone for a bargain.

 

a portfolio, I must still build lol I seem to just sell everything I own ;)

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SADiamondsrus    10
SADiamondsrus

Oh, also wanted to ask what is your experience with GIA in turn around time, I read their turn around time 30 days +

 

Is this true?

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