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Not1CentMore

Damage In Transit

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Not1CentMore    10
Not1CentMore

Methinks Admin will be needed to sort this one out, but Forum members, I would appreciate your feedback.

 

Buyer bids/wins five auctions. These items were carefully inspected, carefully packaged with 2 - 3" of 'padding' all the way 'round and placed inside a medium weight container (as with most all parcels), and shipped (items had been ordered prior to listing and were due to arrive within four business days after auction closed). Buyer now tells me three items, in three separate parcels, have been received and ALL were 'broke' and wants a refund / replacement.

 

Carefully noted in each auction / Shipping & Payment tab:

 

INSURANCE: Not offered. Seller will not be responsible for loss or damage in transit, neither will Buyer be entitled to a refund, in whole or in part, for any loss or damage in transit.

 

I have asked Buyer for 'proof' (pictures of container and of damaged items). Can Buyer make a claim through his Post Office? Should I order and ship replacements.... even though terms state no refund? What 'proof' is there that parcels arrived in order and Buyer 'changed mind' and did not 'damage' items to receive refund? I hate to think this is a possibility, but people sometimes do the 'unthinkable'.... Want to 'do right' / ' be fair', but.... seems 'strange' three items / three parcels to same Buyer arrive ' broken'.

 

Guys 'n Gals.... I am 'open' to your expertise on how this should be resolved. I have had maybe 5 parcels in nearly 8-years 'go missing' or were damaged. With others lost or damaged, I have sent replacements, but, again.... three separate items / parcels to same Buyer arriving damaged... :confused:.

 

Thanks.

 

Ruthie

Edited by Not1CentMore

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lilythepink    10
lilythepink

Oh dear, Ruthie. There could be several scenarios ...

 

1. The buyer could be the problem!

2. SA Post Office could be the problem. With the current wave of strikes, the elephants in our SAPO system could have run amok and damaged parcels - who can tell?

3. Damage could have occurred before the parcel reached SA shores.

 

I think you need to PM Cuan on this as it is most strange that all three parcels to the same buyer have suffered damage. I tend to smell a rat, too.

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miraclebabycaw    10
miraclebabycaw

I agree with Lily on this. Chat with Cuan. I must admit though I had a batch where 2 parcels were broken. Both of them were packed exceptionally well as I knew they were fragile..in loads of bubble wrap and also heavy strong boxes. The Post office must have really dumped heavy stuff on them or jumped on them or something. They were to 2 different people though but in the same postal batch. I offered refunds to both. One lady changed her rating to positive, as she said it was not my fault, the other left it as neutral..neither sent back or wanted their money back. I would ask for photos at least so you can see what damage was done.

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Not1CentMore    10
Not1CentMore

Thank-you for your input.

 

I sent Buyer an email requesting pictures of damaged items as well as pictures of packaging materials and containers on or before Monday, 15th October PM (my time). Buyer was also notified that failure to send pictures would consitute items having been received in 'acceptable' order by Buyer.

 

So far, no response.

 

Ruthie

Edited by Not1CentMore

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mrmouse    11
mrmouse
Thank-you for your input.

 

I sent Buyer an email requesting pictures of damaged items as well as pictures of packaging materials and containers on or before Monday, 15th October PM (my time). Buyer was also notified that failure to send pictures would consitute items having been received in 'acceptable' order by Buyer.

 

So far, no response.

 

Ruthie

Damage in transit is the sellers responsibility entirely , SAPO will only cover for outright loss ,, otherwise people will post damaged goods to friends and claim from insurance as SAPO`s fault ,, once again it is the sellers responsibility completely to ensure the buyer recieves the goods in a satisfactory state and condition and not the buyers ,, that will stand up in a small claims court , CPA states all goods remain the sellers responsibility untill the buyer is "satisfied" ???? .

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lilythepink    10
lilythepink

But if the seller is resident outside South Africa, I don't believe that the South African CPA would be applicable to them.

 

Cuan - what are your views on this?

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mrmouse    11
mrmouse

If they sell into SA it will be ,if exporting it will only apply to the point of exit .but once again its an open discussion , does the CPA have the time to check every reported case , is it worth chasing , probably not , unless very high value items nobody is going to care .

Edited by mrmouse

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qball    10
qball
But if the seller is resident outside South Africa, I don't believe that the South African CPA would be applicable to them.

 

Cuan - what are your views on this?

 

Even if the seller is based overseas, they are selling on a South African site, therefore are subject to our laws - the CPA would still apply.

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lilythepink    10
lilythepink

Thanks, Cuan. I should have thought of that!

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wayjen    10
wayjen

I sold a book which only had some wear to the DJ. The Buyer emails us to say the book is damaged so I ask for pictures of the book and yes it is damaged.

 

The listing I have shows no damage. My description mentions the book as neat and only wear to the DJ. What now, I have offered a refund to the Buyer and I will get back a book that is damaged somewhere between our front door and the email the Buyer has sent me.

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lilythepink    10
lilythepink

How on earth did the PO manage to damage a book, Wayne? Good grief! As a matter of interest, what is the damage to the book? (My mind is boggling at what has happened since you posted it!) :rolleyes::huh:

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wayjen    10
wayjen

Janet, we are dumbfounded too. The book in question had no issues whatsoever except the worn DJ and this I mentioned in the

listing. The pictures show that the pages are damaged.. The packaging does not seem to be damaged according to the Buyer but I can say with 100% conviction that the book left here with no damage at all.

?ui=2&ik=591794af67&view=att&th=13a6a167d649fc52&attid=0.3.1&disp=thd&zw

 

We offered a full refund with postage and because we cannot determine how or when the book got damaged we told the Buyer to keep the book, he replied that we only need to refund half of what he paid.

 

This is very strange indeed.

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JohnBenn    10
JohnBenn

This sounds more like the blame is on our side..here's another sellers stating damaged goods.I bet you they played soccer with the parcels out of boredom...

 

"Never before did we have so many neutral or negative ratings. From damaged goods to late delivery,the list goes on...." - HDMI.

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mrmouse    11
mrmouse
Janet, we are dumbfounded too. The book in question had no issues whatsoever except the worn DJ and this I mentioned in the

listing. The pictures show that the pages are damaged.. The packaging does not seem to be damaged according to the Buyer but I can say with 100% conviction that the book left here with no damage at all.

?ui=2&ik=591794af67&view=att&th=13a6a167d649fc52&attid=0.3.1&disp=thd&zw

 

We offered a full refund with postage and because we cannot determine how or when the book got damaged we told the Buyer to keep the book, he replied that we only need to refund half of what he paid.

 

This is very strange indeed.

Is it the book you sold ? do you mark and photograph books ,LP`s etc , is the new book a replacement for a worn out book , ? you can use a UV pen to mark books etc with, on a certain spot , they fade away after a while and are not noticeable , its worth the effort for goods without serial numbers .

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wayjen    10
wayjen
Is it the book you sold ? do you mark and photograph books ,LP`s etc , is the new book a replacement for a worn out book , ? you can use a UV pen to mark books etc with, on a certain spot , they fade away after a while and are not noticeable , its worth the effort for goods without serial numbers .

 

Well, I cannot say with 100% certainty that the pictures sent to me are in fact the book I sold what I can say with 100% certainty is that I never listed or sold a book with those damaged pages.

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wayjen    10
wayjen

Well we made our refund today.

 

Do any of you, that buy on BoB, take pictures at the PO if you see the parcel is damaged? In all my 21 years on this earth (I look younger), I have yet to see a person at the post office receive a damaged parcel nevermind taking a picture of one. What does the CPA (if it goes that far), have to say regarding damaged goods and is there a time limit to take matter to the CPA as this sounds like more drama then what it's worth?

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lilythepink    10
lilythepink

No, I have never seen anyone photographing a damaged parcel at the Post Office. However, on the occasions that I have received damaged parcels (several times over the past year) I have asked for the postmaster to come and watch as I open it! (Most of those parcels have been sealed with PO tape stating that the parcel had been "damaged"). Fortunately for me, no items have ever been missing or damaged so I've not had to lodge a claim. But with the postmaster checking with me, I feel I would have a stronger case.

 

Are we all now expected to go to the PO armed with our cameras? Perhaps this would be a good thing to start doing!!! I wonder, though, if PO security wouldn't escort us out of the PO as promptly as they do cellphone users???

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wayjen    10
wayjen

I wonder if any of this would stand in a court of law? Unless you have the PO manager or some sort of identification we can take pictures in our toilets and say we took the picture at the PO. Next step is a signed affidavit from the PO branch manager.

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lilythepink    10
lilythepink

I totally agree about the affidavits we should get from our postmaster! I wouldn't hesitate to get him to fill in a form (not all POs have them, apparently!) and get him to add the comment that I have opened the problem parcel in his presence! The CPA is a fine bunch of "laws" but who is "policing" them? Mr Nobody, I would guess - the same one that is never around when so many other laws are broken!

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soltangriss    10
soltangriss

From a buyer viewpoint. If the CPA states that "all goods remain the sellers responsibility untill the buyer is satisfied" why should the buyer be the one that pays for insurance on shipping? As the seller is the one responsible insurance should be included in his/her shipping quote. If a seller wishes to ship sans insurance then he should be aware of the risks involved.

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Not1CentMore    10
Not1CentMore
From a buyer viewpoint. If the CPA states that "all goods remain the sellers responsibility untill the buyer is satisfied"....

 

That may be true, but at some point....

 

Parcel arrived at Buyer's Post Office on 19th November. Buyer sent notification parcel was at Post Office and provided with tracking / pick up number. When Buyer went to collect, she was advised parcel was not there. I contacted USPS and verified the parcel WAS at her Post Office according to their tracking. She went back and forth to her Post Office 4x in next two weeks. Bingo-bango-bongo... Post Office FOUND the parcel on 7th December... and container was 'smushed' and contents 'broken'.

 

I have advised Buyer to file a complaint with her Post Office as any 'damage' is more than likely a result of them allowing parcels to 'play' hide-'n-seek (and leap frog and heaven only knows what other games) for 18-days.

 

Ruthie

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wayjen    10
wayjen

If "all goods remain the sellers responsibility until the buyer is satisfied", then Sellers must not ask for tracking numbers to our parcels.

Where does one draw the line when it comes to who owns a parcel that was purchased online?

 

 

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