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Annie737

Excessive shipping charged by sellers adi1 and christinas

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I bought 6 items in total from these two sellers recently - amongst others some Crazy Wed items at R1. The total purchase amount is R37. Now I am required to pay R180 postage? Reason- R20 postage for each item won on Crazy auctions. This was not always the case. I have made purchases from both sellers in the past and found them to be pleasant and accommodating. They were always willing to combine my purchases at standard PO rates, since they are in the same building. I dont want to soil the good relationship we have, but this does not seem fair and in my view amounts to abuse. Is the whole rationale behind Crazy Auctions not to take your chances and cut your losses if it so happens? Is it ok to recover "losses" with excessive postage?

 

Please assist BOB.

 

Bonipi

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I would say that you should:

 

a) have checked what the auction listings stated about shipping charges

b) have asked them first whether combined shipping was an option before bidding.

 

But then that is just me as a buyer.

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Excessive shipping charges and less accurate answers by Seller

 

Had similar unfortunate experience from a Seller. Put a bid in on Tanzanites - ROUND CUT NATURAL MINED TANZANITES was sold for R6.00 on 6 May at 21:16 by bid 4 buy in White River (ID:64743492) at R1.00 each for 30. The quantities specified: MINIMUM BID IS 2, MAXIMUM BID IS 30. Luckily I only won part of the bid on 4 of these stones which measures about 2mm each. Postage specified R45.00 for the first item and R5.00 each additional item. Buyers asked questions pertaining to postage which are as follows:

Q: Hi there,

I am interested in bidding on a few tanzanites you have on auction. Before I do so though, I would like to know whether you could combine the tanzanites in one package so that i only have to pay one postal fee (R45) instead of R45 multiple times. It makes more sense.

 

Please let me know soonest (as I see your bids end tonight)

 

Kind regards - Asked by D

02 May 13:00

 

 

 

A:Hi yes sure you can bid on multiple auctions and only pay 1 postage fee. Many of our buyers do this to save on postage fees - kind regards

02 May 14:00

 

 

After I won and wanted to process the payment the postage came to R60.00. I sent the Seller an e-mail and asked about the postage fee, because the minimum bid was for 2 items and naturally assumed that at least the first 2 will be covered by the R45.00 postage, and the remaining 2 will fit in the same envelope at no extra cost from SAPO. Received the following answer:

 

R45 is postage, the other R5 for additional items is for payment of human beings, that use their labour to pack the gems for you. So yes it is imperative that you pay the additional R5 per item or no-one will pack them for you.

 

Luckily I did not win the whole lot at R1.00 each or else I would have paid R45.00 + 29 x R5.00, which will total to R190.00 postage for something that would fit into half a matchbox. It seems that some Sellers definitely make more money on bogus postage fees than on the stuff they sell as per the analysis of this selling of 30 tanzanites:

 

Winning Bidders:

Page views: 36 | Buyers: 5

10 at R6.00 each, on 6 May 09:10, by D

10 at R6.00 each, on 6 May 21:09, by D

4 at R6.00 each, on 6 May 09:25, by D

2 at R6.00 each, on 6 May 11:00, by D

4 of 30 at R1.00 each, on 5 May 19:39, by Chippy Crew (92 rating2.gif)

 

Income for the selling of 30 tanzanites

10 x R6.00 = R60.00

10 x R6.00 = R60.00

4 x R6.00 = R24.00

2x R2.00 = R12.00

4 x R1.00 = R4.00

Total: R160.00

 

Income on postage for the selling of 30 tanzanites

10: R45.00 + (9 x R5.00) = R90.00

10: R45.00 + (9 x R5.00) = R90.00

4: R45.00 + (3 x R5.00) = R60.00

2: R45.00 + (1 x R5.00) = R50.00

4: R45.00 + (3 x R5.00) = R60.00

Total: R350.00

 

If posted in a padded jiffy envelope as an Econoparcel at the approximate cost of R21.00 and the cost of the jiffy envelope at R12.00 (expensive one) the total expenses will amount to R165.00.

 

The total profit on the postage venture will come to R350.00 - R165.00 = R185.00

 

Is there a governing body on BOB which check these things and actually do something about it? Because a lot of new buyers come in and get burned by these Sellers and never come back.

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Losing out on auctions is an acceptable risk. Losing out for sure on postage is not.

 

If someone is in the same building then just ask them if the items can be collected. If postage for small items seem excessive then ask before bidding. Amazingly the only question asked is if postage can be combined and nobody asks about the combining fee. If the minimum bid is 2 items and it's not for a single bid then it's naturally assumed the additional charge will apply to the second item.

 

I don't know how many times this has been said. READ the whole listing including delivery charges BEFORE bidding and if an agreement cannot be reached then don't bid. Simple.

 

As the items have probably not been delivered yet we wouldn't know why the R5 fee. Of course a seller would make some profit on postage as the only other option is losing. Some people will however complain even if the profit is 1c. :rolleyes:

Edited by Prom
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It is against the South African Postal Act (not sure of its exact name!) to try and make a profit out of postage. This is a criminal offence! Sellers need to be aware of this. And it is not a petty crime either but "white collar" crime which is being treated harshly by the Courts in this day and age!

 

It just needs a couple of buyers to report sellers who overcharge on postage ...

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around and around the Mulberry Bush the Mulberry bush etc

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Oooooppppppssss ... Stay away MsPlod. Stay away. :toung:

 

Hi Chippy Crew. The seller appears very clever, seems she has her hook and line very well set up.

 

A:Hi yes sure you can bid on multiple auctions and only pay 1 postage fee. Many of our buyers do this to save on postage fees - kind regards

 

Pretty vague answer when you eventually find out what she means. And the tone of response changes quite a bit once you have been reeled in, doesn't it.

 

R45 is postage, the other R5 for additional items is for payment of human beings, that use their labour to pack the gems for you. So yes it is imperative that you pay the additional R5 per item or no-one will pack them for you.

 

From polite and friendly to sarcastic.

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I actually like it : or nobody will pack it for you >>> HeeeeHeeee ,,,,very very clever.

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This is actually the same thing I queried with QBall yesterday , postage and minimum quantitys , its a quick and easy way to make profit on low sales prices , by making the second item chargeable .I feel the whole freight story for small items needs a look at .

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Ai, Mr Mouse. Postage fees are an ongoing saga and there is no real solution.

 

All buyers can do is check the postage, query if it is too high, report the seller to BoB and move on to an ethical seller.

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Please send the details of this transaction to communitywatch@bidorbuy.co.za for investigation. We cannot unfortunately monitor all postage options or methods, as long as the seller is reasonable we don't have a problem, but this in my view seems unreasonable.

 

Thanks

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Thanks QBall, will send the details to Community Watch's e-mail address. Lets all hold thumbs, maybe something 'good' will happen. :noworry::nuts:

 

Regards

Chippy Crew

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Oooooppppppssss ... Stay away MsPlod. Stay away. :toung:

tiptoes quietly past... gosh, wonder which trader this might be? LOL!

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It seems to be that the high postage costs will never really be resolved because we have a lot of buyers/sellers complaining about high postage and yet a quick look on BoB shows just the same high postage costs most everywhere. I do understand that some sellers may pack very well & may use this as a kind of justification for their high costs but then again, I too pack very well and yet my postage costs remain at a reasonable rate and whether I sell an item for R1.00 or for R1000.00 the same care goes into the packaging & the same postal rates apply. Do buyers really have to pay extra to ensure safe & secure packaging? This really could be viewed upon as postal blackmail (if there is such a thing) Where then do we draw the line? Working on an econoparcel which is under 1kg & costs R20.50 to post, what would be high postage on this.....R40, R50, R70, R100? The figure you choose is irrelevant because on all the figures there is still a profit been made? As I have always said, incorporate all costs into the selling price of the item, not into the postage costs...postage costs should be just that, the cost of posting an item and SAPO has decided to make that cost R20.50 for an econoparcel. I really am curious to know what can justify postage of R20.50 item suddenly jumping up to R40, R50, R70, R100. Fancy packaging? I don’t want it. Perfumed thingys in my parcel? I don’t want it. Free gift? I don’t want it & then too it is no longer free seeing as I am spending much more on postage than I should be doing. Pretty little bows & things? I don’t want it. Petrol? This should be incorporated into selling price. Brown paper, sellotape, cardboard, printing my order, looking at my order come in on the pc, emailing me my tracking number, working after hours etc etc etc. Should all be incorporated into selling price of item. So I am still failing to see what justifies high postage costs?

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Sam you are right. This morning I came on the forum and was mad as hell and typed a long post but then deleted it afterwards because the issue of postage will never go away.

 

When is shipping too much and when is it reasonable? Is it ok to not report a seller for high postage costs because I have bought from them before and they pack securely? Who are we to report a stranger for high shipping costs when we have not bought from them before because they too could be packaging their items in such a way that we would need the jaws of life to open the item?

 

Why do people assume that because so and so ships for X amount do they expect another seller to ship a similar item at the same price? Why do buyers automatically assume that a seller with whom they had dealings with in the past, is still using the same old price now as they did before?

 

Just read the listing and shipping sides for all the information and if you don't like it just walk away.

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mrmouse was bought over, we have lost one to the Dark Side.

Edited by wayjen
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Sam you are right. This morning I came on the forum and was mad as hell and typed a long post but then deleted it afterwards because the issue of postage will never go away.

 

When is shipping too much and when is it reasonable? Is it ok to not report a seller for high postage costs because I have bought from them before and they pack securely? Who are we to report a stranger for high shipping costs when we have not bought from them before because they too could be packaging their items in such a way that we would need the jaws of life to open the item?

 

Why do people assume that because so and so ships for X amount do they expect another seller to ship a similar item at the same price? Why do buyers automatically assume that a seller with whom they had dealings with in the past, is still using the same old price now as they did before?

 

Just read the listing and shipping sides for all the information and if you don't like it just walk away.

 

Correct, if you don't like it stroll along somewhere else but before making a song & dance about it be sure that your costs are all above board as well. But hey, look on the bright side....maybe we can up our postage to let's say R50 on an econoparcel & in every parcel toss in a free Smartie or something :idea:

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The funny thing is that if you add all your costs into the price of the item, the buyers will think that is too expensive.

 

It is not possible to use a R20 econo bag or whatever they call it to ship a book and the same bag to ship a beer mug. some things need more rapping then other things and while both items might be of a similar size each one needs special care for the transporting of it.

Edited by wayjen
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The funny thing is that if you add all your costs into the price of the item, the buyers will think that is too expensive.

 

It is not possible to use a R20 econo bag or whatever they call it to ship a book and the same bag to ship a beer mug. some things need more rapping then other things and while both items might be of a similar size each one needs special care for the transporting of it.

 

I understand that & while I don't sell breakables I do know that a whole lot more packaging material would be needed for it so if I were buying eg: a fancy plate, even though I know it weighs perhaps 200g I would still pay postage of +- R40 because of it's fiddly nature BUT imagine now I am buying a book, and it weighs under 1kg - where is the justification of charging eg: R50 to post it?

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I just had to have it !!!!!!!!!! somethings arent worth worrying about for to long ,, I think ive stirred enough now my arms are tired , lets go see what else Magicbox has on special:grin:

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I actually like it : or nobody will pack it for you >>> HeeeeHeeee ,,,,very very clever.

 

My thoughts exactly.

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Ai, Mr Mouse. Postage fees are an ongoing saga and there is no real solution.

 

All buyers can do is check the postage, query if it is too high, report the seller to BoB and move on to an ethical seller.

 

unfortunately non of the ethical sellers have what I want , bought a wall clock ,it came without a movement and no glass and 2 hands stuck on with sticky tape on the face , when I queried it I was told sorry no refund its an auction !you should have asked if it had a movement and glass and not just assumed it:wtf:..Bought a computer it had been struck by lightning and the circuit board was burnt black ,HoHum , the list is very very long .:sad2:

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Wayjen are you suggesting that BOB should allow a Seller to use "postage costs" to augment their income on the sale of goods? Should a Buyer pay R100 for postage on 2 items which cost R1 each and receive the package with the postage costs stamped on it for only R18.58? I am certain that an intelligent person like you will feel a bit ripped off- even slightly.

 

It is like you finding a gas station which advertises petrol (government price controlled) at R1.00 per liter. You fill up the tank and when you have to pay find that the pumping fee is R25.00 per liter which is stated on the other side of the advertisement. :evil:

 

I don't think that BOB want their reputation/legacy in the general public to be known as a business that condones their Buyers being ripped off by Sellers using their system. There are only a few bad apples in the barrel and obviously there are excellent Sellers like Malcolm44, Neux, Spyguy, JM0007, African Fly Angler etc. with whom I have done business with in the past.

 

One would rather have a BOB business reputation/legacy of providing a platform where one can buy and sell with confidence.

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It is against the South African Postal Act (not sure of its exact name!) to try and make a profit out of postage. This is a criminal offence! Sellers need to be aware of this. And it is not a petty crime either but "white collar" crime which is being treated harshly by the Courts in this day and age!

 

It just needs a couple of buyers to report sellers who overcharge on postage ...

And the exact words here are "try and make a profit." This would most likely apply to someone setting up a courier service that people pay to send items through the post office. Even then it would be difficult to prove as what people usually forget is that it's postage and packaging and other services and not just postage. What I was really saying is that people should expect there's some profit as the only other option is losing out. It's unavoidable.

 

@voldermort: I think we all get what you're saying. Unfortunately it doesn't work that way. I stirred the pot over bob's charges before and will obviously not discuss that again as the issue is obviously untouchable. (closed threads, shutdown of conversation, etc.) :rolleyes: My opinion however won't change. Just as you claim people don't have a right to make profit out of "postage" charges so too doesn't bob have that right. By incorporating extra charges into the product price they are in fact doing exactly that. It's already enough that bob makes money on the total cost like an extra VAT so I won't relent that they shouldn't make even more money from our expenses on top of that. So who do you think I'll buy from? The guy who asks R51+R30p&p or the one who asks R40+R40p&p?

 

It seems most complaints are from people after they click buy. Again if people just READ the delivery charges the sellers who really overcharge won't be selling. Maybe bob should implement an extra measure where people actually have to answer the correct delivery charges and accept them before bidding. Clever buyers can of course opt-out but nobody would be able to complain any more.

 

 

We still don't even know nor have any way to determine if he was overcharging.

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I'm not saying that because people are doing that as we speak and we have/are discussing that right this very minute on the forum.

Why not go look at the threads on the forum and see where we discussing it, look at some of the posters on this forum and see for yourself how they justify their postage costs or if you want me to do tell you, they ARE using postage costs to "augment their income" and it's written in the shipping descriptions. Now is that right, do we allow it because it's in black and white and not a hidden surprise feature? Do we allow it because it's in black and white AND they pack so wonderfully that it's worth the money?

 

Someone suggested that sellers incorporate their packaging fees into the price of the item on auction thereby keeping postage costs at a bare minimum and my response was that should that happen a buyer might think the item is too expensive so a lose lose either way.

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