Diffused ruby for R37500 anyone?

[Cali Craft and Gems 10]

Rubies - Rare!!! AAA pigeon blood red diffused Asscher cut Madagascar ruby IF 208.000ct 29.80x28.00x17.20mm was sold for R37,500.00 on 5 Feb at 21:01 by gml in Theunissen (ID:56948858)

 

I am caught between a rock and a hard place because both the buyer and seller are customers' of mine so I don't want to cause any trouble for anyone concerned. However, for the seller to offer this gem at that price is beyond me - he should feel guilty! And for the buyer paying that price - he should have his head read!

 

In the Q&A of this particular listing:

Q: Can you tell me where you obtained the indicative market price of this gem?? thks - Asked by dreammeals

 

A: Hi, Thanks for showing an interest in my items. Currently GISA values sapphires and rubies that undergone diffusion treatment for gems at +/- 5 carat size at about R 4,500.00 per carat. Natural rubies that undergone heat treatment and/or lead filling is now going for about R16,000.00 per carat, and that is very small ones that is not very scarce...Diffusion treatment rubies should be 40% cheaper - check internet sources to confirm this...To say the indicative market value of this rare gem is only R 416,000.00 - this at only R 2,000.00 per carat is an understatement by far...!!! Happy bidding....

 

 

I for one would never sell a diffused ruby for more than R50 per carat! Am I missing something or am I on the wrong boat?!?

[Lukeness 10]

That's odd. My biggest (by far) concern would be whether or not that stone was even natural.

[alloway65 10]

That's odd. My biggest (by far) concern would be whether or not that stone was even natural.

 

Me Too!!!!!!!:thinking:

[MiemsJewels 10]

Price Guide: $150.00 per carat. $672

Negotiable. Enhancement code - E

 

Glass: Filled

GENUINE LOOSE RUBY

GEMSTONE: RUBY

CARAT WEIGHT: 4.48ct

SHAPE: EMERALD CUT

COLOR: RED (AAA)

CLARITY: VS-SI

BIRTHSTONE: JULY

 

 

TREATMENT: FILLED

MEASUREMENTS: 10.5 x 7.3 x 4.5 mm

ORIGIN: AFRICA

 

AAA Emerald Cut VS-SI Pigeon Blood Natural Red Ruby 4.48ct

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Edited February 19, 2012 by MiemsJewels

[Lukeness 10]

Can't really use those as pricing references as the size of that stone would make it rather desirable, diffused or not. Also, that pricing is for filled gems and possibly at wholesale. From the picture it also look like it has a strong orange component which would make it a fancy sapphire, not a ruby. I still cannot believe that stone is natural. Rubies are, as a rule, included. Real stones like that are marketed between exclusive dealers in hushed venues where they can keep the deals quiet.

[MsPlod 10]

Well well well - goodness me! Sharavan got shopped IMHO! Big time! 416k as an indicative price for a diffused ruby is just OTT ridiculous. Just as a matter of interest, would anyone know whether gml and dreammeals are related or good buddies?

[Cali Craft and Gems 10]

Both gml and dreammeals are buyers' of mine... addresses are many miles apart! No idea if there is any connection, although I doubt it. Dreammeals was probably just trying to politely highlight a serious query.

[kyle2 10]

I think the only real winner here would be BoB withthe lovely commission on that item.

I have one of these aprox that size and shape, I'll let go for R2000.00, any takers?LOL

[Lukeness 10]

Per carat?

lol

[ATOMICSQUIRREL 10]

I'm sure the buyer of the gem is prob a jeweler and has plans to knock somebody else HAAARD!!

....but as far as i know a diffused ruby is still a 100% ruby except for the fact that its man made and Flawless!

...or am i missing something?

[Lukeness 10]

Diffused rubies are NOT man made rubies. There seems to be a lot of confusion in this regard. Diffused rubies are natural (so lot really likely to be flawless at that size) but artificially coloured.

[ATOMICSQUIRREL 10]

so how would you know the difference between a "Real Fake" and the "Real Deal"?

:wtf:

[ATOMICSQUIRREL 10]

Rubies - Rare!!! AAA pigeon blood red diffused Asscher cut Madagascar ruby IF 208.000ct 29.80x28.00x17.20mm was sold for R37,500.00 on 5 Feb at 21:01 by gml in Theunissen (ID:56948858)

 

I am caught between a rock and a hard place because both the buyer and seller are customers' of mine so I don't want to cause any trouble for anyone concerned. However, for the seller to offer this gem at that price is beyond me - he should feel guilty! And for the buyer paying that price - he should have his head read!

 

In the Q&A of this particular listing:

Q: Can you tell me where you obtained the indicative market price of this gem?? thks - Asked by dreammeals

 

A: Hi, Thanks for showing an interest in my items. Currently GISA values sapphires and rubies that undergone diffusion treatment for gems at +/- 5 carat size at about R 4,500.00 per carat. Natural rubies that undergone heat treatment and/or lead filling is now going for about R16,000.00 per carat, and that is very small ones that is not very scarce...Diffusion treatment rubies should be 40% cheaper - check internet sources to confirm this...To say the indicative market value of this rare gem is only R 416,000.00 - this at only R 2,000.00 per carat is an understatement by far...!!! Happy bidding....

 

 

I for one would never sell a diffused ruby for more than R50 per carat! Am I missing something or am I on the wrong boat?!?

 

 

Did Theunissen buy that ruby from you?

[Cali Craft and Gems 10]

In reply to Vortechz - no, he did not. Over the years he has only bought small items and beads.

[MiemsJewels 10]

Did Theunissen buy that ruby from you?

 

LOL Vortechz, Theunissen is a town in the Free State!!

[ATOMICSQUIRREL 10]

LOL Vortechz, Theunissen is a town in the Free State!!

 

 

LMAO, misread it "Blush":oops:

 

I mean did Gml buy it from you?

[GemDeals 10]

Natural rubies that undergone heat treatment and/or lead filling is now going for about R16,000.00 per carat

 

:biggrin: I wish i lived on his planet, that is about the price for heated Burmese rubies per carat. He is talking balony, plain and simple.

 

Average retail value

 

Gemstone variety: Ruby

Weight: 1.00 cts.

Color: 220 - medium slightly purplish Red; strong (Burma, heated)

Clarity: VVS, Eye clean 1

Cut: Excellent

Shape: Oval

Value: USD 2,507.21

 

Valuation date: 21 Feb 2012

 

 

 

Value of Madagascan fracture filled ruby? less than $10 per ct. last i had a stone valuated for a client it was a 5ct top red stone.

 

Is the stone is authentic? vss rubies are expensive and rare. It can be that it is a vss other color 20+ct sapphire that they diffused red, however the likeliness of that is astronomical. It is most probably synthetic just like this stone on auction today:

 

Rubies - **LATE LISTING** AWESOME AND AMAZING BLOOD RED RUBY - OVAL CUT - MADAGASCAR - 22.75ct for sale in Elsburg (ID:58971895)

 

It most probably a synthetic stone like this:

 

Rubies - CHATHAM RUBY SALE @ R1 START - 22.50CT - FLAWLESS - OVAL CUT - BLOOD RED for sale in Pretoria / Tshwane (ID:58998501)

 

I think i should mention that sellers are legally binded to gemstone sales, presenting gems under false pretenses i.e a synthetic stone as "from Madagascar" is fraud.

[MiemsJewels 10]

:biggrin: I wish i lived on his planet, that is about the price for heated Burmese rubies per carat. He is talking balony, plain and simple.

 

 

Value of Madagascan fracture filled ruby? less than $10 per ct. last i had a stone valuated for a client it was a 5ct top red stone.

 

Is the stone is authentic? vss rubies are expensive and rare. It can be that it is a vss other color 20+ct sapphire that they diffused red, however the likeliness of that is astronomical. It is most probably synthetic just like this stone on auction today:

 

Rubies - **LATE LISTING** AWESOME AND AMAZING BLOOD RED RUBY - OVAL CUT - MADAGASCAR - 22.75ct for sale in Elsburg (ID:58971895)

 

It most probably a synthetic stone like this:

 

Rubies - CHATHAM RUBY SALE @ R1 START - 22.50CT - FLAWLESS - OVAL CUT - BLOOD RED for sale in Pretoria / Tshwane (ID:58998501)

 

I think i should mention that sellers are legally binded to gemstone sales, presenting gems under false pretenses i.e a synthetic stone as "from Madagascar" is fraud.

 

Hi Gemdeals, I am sure this sellers got the descriptions from their suppliers! Then the suppliers must have sold it to them under false pretences! What now?

 

I forgot to mention that both the sellers have 100% positive ratings! Only a few neutrals.

Edited February 21, 2012 by MiemsJewels

[GemDeals 10]

I just wish everyone took the time to take a few stones of each supplier to a certified gemologist. I think the seller is at least partially responsible for the items he sells. I just hope the buyer of that R40 000 ruby will have it certified and appraised, or he is set for some hard times when he has to sell it.

 

I think on the rating's, not a lot of buyers even have their stones certified because of the expense and effort. Sad really..

[alloway65 10]

I sent away a number of Gemstones bought on BoB for Certification a couple of years ago, from memory about 15% were Hydrothermal Stones and about 10% were different gems to those specified by the Seller(s).

 

Hence I am no longer a buyer of Gemstones!!!

 

Also large diamonds bought for my wife were bought from reputable dealers and were independently Certified.

[MiemsJewels 10]

I sent away a number of Gemstones bought on BoB for Certification a couple of years ago, from memory about 15% were Hydrothermal Stones and about 10% were different gems to those specified by the Seller(s).

 

Hence I am no longer a buyer of Gemstones!!!

 

Also large diamonds bought for my wife were bought from reputable dealers and were independently Certified.

 

Correct Alloway! You can buy my stones with confident, definitly NOT hydrothermal! They are ALL bought from reputable dealers! :biggrin:

[Miss Jewels 10]

I have recently decided to have all my tanzanite stones sent to EGL in CT for authentification. As for diamonds, I take them to a jeweler (with the certificate from the supplier) just for my own peace of mind. Obviously there are costs involved, but then you either work it into your selling price or offer the certificate at an extra charge.

The main core is to purchase from reputable sellers and unfortunately not all e-bay sellers are very honest. To most of them it's about the money.

Build up a good relationship with an honest supplier and you'll find that buyers will be more comfortable with purchasing high priced items from you.

There is an old saying...it costs money to make money. Take the time and effort and make sure you know what you are selling.

[MiemsJewels 10]

Very good idea Miss Jewels. My only problem is, I must drive to Johannesburg, or send it through the post, to get a certificate Risky business! WITSPOS!

[SADiamondsrus 10]

Can't really use those as pricing references as the size of that stone would make it rather desirable, diffused or not. Also, that pricing is for filled gems and possibly at wholesale. From the picture it also look like it has a strong orange component which would make it a fancy sapphire, not a ruby. I still cannot believe that stone is natural. Rubies are, as a rule, included. Real stones like that are marketed between exclusive dealers in hushed venues where they can keep the deals quiet.

 

 

Finally someone who knows his stuff.

 

Many factors play a part in value of an item, of course, the size plays a part due to it being a rare size.

 

what makes a gem un-natural? (other than man made?)

 

If it is naturally mined, but enhanced, does it become man made? I dont think so. BUT being natural and enhanced, the enhancement must be disclosed.

 

Generally then enhanced gem is valued at 30-40% below the counterpart of not being treated at all.

 

Thus, if the value is + - R400K, the diffused version should be + - R200K (I would only buy if certified to be ruby and yes, rubies are generally included esp LARGE sizes

[alloway65 10]

Very good idea Miss Jewels. My only problem is, I must drive to Johannesburg, or send it through the post, to get a certificate Risky business! WITSPOS!

 

I am sure a courier would cost more or less the same as Speed Services. MDS insures for up to R5000.00 for R14.00. Good luck.

 

I have just couriered a 3kg package to CT today for R90.00 Incl VAT.

David.