Question & Answer Forum (where buyers and sellers intera

[mwgielink 10]

Hello reader

 

I have recently seen stamps on bidorbuy (this passed crazy Wedensday) with holes punched in them. Now, I have some S.A. revenue stamps with similar holes punched in them. Is this normal, or are they worthless? I mean, it looks like someone took a standard filing punch and punched holes through them.

 

Does anyone have an explination for me?

 

Thanks

Mark

[Jacques Kuun 11]

Hello Mark

 

They might be or not be common, but they are definitely not worthless.

 

Perhaps you should supply more information. People like Gabriel1, Goslin or Seahorsefanatic should be able to help you on these.

 

Regards

 

Jacques

[AngelaBraun 10]

Hello Mark

 

Mozambique stamps with a punch like) hole in them (usually imperf) are actually known as proofs. If I am not mistaken, some south and north American stamps also have the same hole (Usually official/fiscal/revenue) stamps.

 

As Jacques states, they are defintely not worthless.

 

PS.

Without sounding vendictive Jacques, beware not to be too sexist we females do have some knowledge regarding philately as well and not only Gabriel1, Seahorsefanatic and Goslin.

[Jacques Kuun 11]

Angela

 

Without sounding vendictive Jacques, beware not to be too sexist

 

An unconditional apology from you will be accepted.

 

I am under no obligation to mention your name in any post.

 

You have no right to slander me.

 

I have mentioned Seahorsefanatic and Gabriel1 because they have bought similar items from me in the past. Clinton Goslin is the undisputed expert on Revenue Stamps. I am sure that Savo does not feel offended because I did not mention him by name. And because of the nature of my post I admitted that I have just about no knowledge on this subject!

 

Our government normally plays the race card. Why?

 

Jacques

[AngelaBraun 10]

I think it is that time of the year, and you are burnt out tired from work work work. Not only do you deserve your little break you are taking but I think it has come just in time.

 

If it is a public apology you want you have my sincerest apology. I said I was not being vendictive and in future I will be very circumspect when I attempt being a little humorous. No offence was meant nor taken on my part.

 

May every stamp seller, dealer, buyer and trader have a wonderful and Blessed Christmas, and may 2009 see all your dreams fulfilled.

 

Angela Braun

[seahorsefanatic 10]

Hi Mark

 

The variables are to be taken into account when looking at punched material be it stamps, documents, labels, etc. As has been said before, each item will need to be looked at on its merits before deciding whether one wants the item in your collection.

 

Punched holes appeared on a number of proof items from all over the world and on documents which were filed away and this brings in the revenue side of philately.

 

Punched holes on covers such as FDC's or postal history would definately detract from the overall apearance and reduce the value of the item. All one then needs to throw into the equation is rarety which then throws out this theory as a truely rare item would still have value and be very collectable even if defaced with punch holes.

 

Regarding South African revenues, one would rather replace revenues with punched holes with one that have staple holes ( less ugly ) or with a manuscript accross them ( writing ) as these are far more attractive. The puch holes on revenues indicates mostly that the documents these stamps were on were filed as so many others were.

 

Rather than sounding vendictive (sic) Jacques, I doubt the comment was meant in a vindictive (revengefull) way but was meant as a vindication (assertion) of woman's place in philately. This posting had nothing to do with men/women, flavour of ice-cream or anything else but no one would question a woman's place in philately when there have been so many top female philatelists over the years and into the future.

 

So Jacques please enjoy your 'little break" which I hope does not sound condesending or patronising. I know I dont need to be told the obvious either so I will enjoy my break to the fullest. (Lots of stamps involved)

 

My special thanks to you in getting me more involved in the Forum as I think it will only grow from strength to strength and the more of us that are involved the more we will all learn and get to know each other as well. We may disagree strongly at times but how boring it would be if we agreed all the time.

 

All the best to everyone for 2009 !!

[mwgielink 10]

Thanks all for you input

 

So basically (correct me if i'm wrong) it comes down to the fact that revenue stamps are usually used on documents that are punched and filed away and as such at times the stamp is punched in the process. So, an unpunched stamp is thus preferable but one can't equate a punched revenue stamp with a torn revenue stamp becasuse although a punched one is not as valuable as an unpunched one it is still not worthless because the punched hole came from part of its use process.

 

Just some further questions:

 

1)

I have a SACC from 1990 that indicated as a colour picture that the 1933-1948 1/2d springbok had a border that contained only horizontal lines (like the 1947-1954 issue). However I now have a 2000 SACC and it indicates that the 1933-1948 1/2d springbok has vertical & horizontal lines in the frame that meet in the corners like the first 1926 issue. If the 2000 SACC is correct then there is only one issue (the 1947-1954) that has only horizontal lines in the border. Which is correct?

 

2)

I note that the 1945-1948 union building issue indicates that the "2" of the "2d" touches the circle (as indicated in the 2000 catelogue), and that the 1947-1954 union building issue has a "2" of the "2d" that does not touch the circle. Now, my problem is that I have a mint horizontal pair of which the "2" of the english stamp appears to touch the circle but the "2" of the afrikaans one does not. So, is it the 1945 issue or the 1947 issue?

 

3)

What is the difference between a black inc cancellation, a purple inc cancellation, a pen scribble & a pencil scribble on a stamp and how do these effect the values? Also which of these does the SACC term "used" apply to?

 

4)

What would you pay for a postally used 1987 40c bible stamp? (I was offered one but could not afford it, but I may act as a middle man for someone else if it is worth my while). (Hope this one is not in breach of any BoB terms).

 

I'll ask my other questions when these are answered (don't want a list that is too long).

 

Thanks

Mark

[Jacques Kuun 11]

Hello Mark

 

I will only refer to your question 1 and 2.

 

The SACC is an invaluable catalogue, but very, very basic as far as Union is concerned. For instance, there were more than 20 Issues of the Half Penny. I will try to get hold of a spare Union Handbook and give it to you on loan. If this is against BidorBuy regulations I will list it on BuyNow. The 2d is more basic, but still a minefield especially as far as the different UNHYPENATED Blue and Violet Shades are concerned. This is really an area where you should buy as many stamps as possible, simply for the sake of a reference. Even single stamps will do when it is about studying the various issues. I have seen many Union stamps listed on BidorBuy where it was obvious that the seller was perhaps acting in good faith, but totally misdescribing the item. Tread very cautiously.

 

Regards

 

Jacques.

[seahorsefanatic 10]

Hi Mark

 

I will have a go at questions 3 & 4:

 

3) A black cancellation will be required on postaly used items as listed in the SACC. Cancellations in purple ink, manuscript cancellations in pencil or pen usually denote fiscal use. This will depend whether you are collecting postage stamps or revenue stamps.

 

One exception here would be stamps used normally for postage but used for revenue purposes and here the postage stamp on a revenue document would be worth more than the same stamp used for postage.

 

Getting back to fiscal stamps, the punched holes in order to file the document away would detract from the value. Just because this was common does not mean it is acceptable to most collectors as un-punched stamps are available for all values.

 

When it comes to revenue/fiscal/cinderella I would refer you to Clinton Goslin who is a specialist in this field who I'm sure will be only to glad to help

 

4) The Bible stamp currently valued at R7,500 used in the 2008/09 SACC catalogue as a single and R7,000 mint and higher values for positional pieces ( control blocks, marginal,etc )

 

Being a modern stamp, its true value will only be set over time but will vary depending on demand for it at the time. In other words one could pay anything from R5,000 to R10,000 for a used copy. A used copy on cover would be the prize but should you be able to buy this stamp at anywhere below R5,000 it would make a good investment.

 

But remember with all investments, there is time needed to add value and with this stamp, it could be between 5 to 10 years.

 

As a last point, there have been rumours on the market over the years about the true quantity of these stamps that are out there. Ive a photocopy of a full sheet of these stamps which I found in a collection - so the question will remain that we dont know how many of these stamps are in the market and whether the market is being artificially stimulated or not.

 

Hope this helps you

[qball 12]

Hi guys

 

Just remember - no personal attacks... it is after all the festive season...

 

Please also do not include contact details on the forum.

 

Thank you

Cuan

[mwgielink 10]

Thanks seahorsefanatic, I have a few normal postal stamps with either purple cancellations or pen/pencil scribbles on them, but the one I'm really interested in is my 1930 1/- horizontal pair of which I have a pair with a black cancellation and a pair with a purple cancellation. So would you say that the purple fiscally cancelled pair is more valuable than the black postally cancelled pair?

[seahorsefanatic 10]

Hi Mark

 

The pair with black cancellation is better than the fiscally used pair with purple cancellation. Remember that the early stamps are inscribed with postage and revenue. so the use of postage stamps as revenue is legitimate but relatively harder to find as low value revenues were available. Where these are sought after is when they are on the document.

 

But always approach with caution as the value you have may be scarce in that particular period. Here I hope Clinton will be able to help. I will ask him to reply to this posting in more detail.

[mwgielink 10]

Hello fellow philatelists

 

Does anyone know if the post office has released any new stamps since the "BIG 5 Birds" ? Every time I have gone to the post office they say no.

 

Thanks

Mark

[gabriel 1 11]

Hi Mark

 

The following were issued:

 

Flowers of Namaqualand - 22 Aug

2010 FIFA World Cup - 5 Sep

30th Anniversary of the Alma Ata - 6 Sep

Heritage Sites Series - 23 Sep

Onderstepoort Centenary - 8 Oct

World Post Day - 9 Oct

The Big 5 Cartoons - 14 Nov

 

To keep yourself up to date on issues visit the SAPO home page and follow the links to stamp issues.

 

Regards

Gabriel1

[Jacques Kuun 11]

Hello Mark

 

Your post:

1930 1/- horizontal pair of which I have a pair with a black cancellation and a pair with a purple cancellation. So would you say that the purple fiscally cancelled pair is more valuable than the black postally cancelled pair?

 

Sometimes the Union higher value got cancelled with a blue / blueish violet / purple rubber stamp. These are parcel cancellations (postally used) and not fiscal cancellations.

 

Regards

 

Jacques