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Not1CentMore

Please Clarify

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Not1CentMore

What part of an auction is a 'contract'? Is this in part or in whole? Is the contractual part the bid amount only or does it also include shipping / insurance costs?

 

I have a buyer who remitted payment for winning bids via PayPal, but said he / she will not pay for shipping / insurance saying he /she would not be needing the items and...well, the rest of the email was not so polite.

 

I thanked buyer for email and told him / her that pursuant to his / her email, I would re-list and file SNC for Terms Not Met. Buyer replied, "Only the bid is a contract, not any other part" and his / her 'tone' went down hill from there.

 

Should I revert $1.00USD received via PayPal (will cost me $1.50USD to revert) and file SNC for Terms Not Met or...what?

 

Ruthie

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TS Ron

Ruthie I do know you have a right to lodge an SNC after seven days to recover your costs. I also understand that the buyer does have a period in which they can decide whether they want to conclude the deal. What I do not understand is how on earth did this buyer think they would receive the goods without shipping cost?

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wayjen

We have asked this question before. What part of the WHOLE experience is the binding contract part?

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Lukeness

The rest of the details like shipping etc are terms of that contract so they would have to be honoured too.

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brands online
Ruthie I do know you have a right to lodge an SNC after seven days to recover your costs. I also understand that the buyer does have a period in which they can decide whether they want to conclude the deal. What I do not understand is how on earth did this buyer think they would receive the goods without shipping cost?

 

Hi there, just to clarify, "cooling off period" does not apply to goods bought on auction per the CPA

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wayjen
Hi there, just to clarify, "cooling off period" does not apply to goods bought on auction per the CPA

 

Does the "cooling of period" also apply to buyers and sellers who are frustrated with each other?

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lilythepink

Now, I think we are all missing the point ... Ruthie is in the USA and this is clearly evident when reading her listings.

 

The CPA would, I believe, not be applicable to her as South African laws do not govern USA citizens unless there is a protracted legal battle which would be too costly for most to afford and, even then, there would be no guarantee that the USA citizen would be found in breach of an auction "contract". So I don't believe that a "cooling off" period would apply to Ruthie. Anyone got a better idea on this?

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qball

As far as we are concerned, when you bid, you are agreeing to the seller's terms including shipping etc.

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Not1CentMore

Thanks, all, for your thoughts. It is greatly appreciated.

Lily...wasn't sure if contracts your side were similar / same as here. Here, they are 'whole' and 'in part'. There is usually wording that says something like, "if a portion or portions of this contract is deemed void, the remaining part of the contract stands and is enforceable". Wasn't sure your side if contracts were 'piece meal' (in part) or in 'whole'. And, yes, it would be too costly to try to collect via Small Claims or...

Thank-you, qball, for clarification.

 

The biggest reason for **READ BEFORE BIDDING** (first three words in auction title) is I prefer my buyers to be INFORMED buyers. That includes them understanding that I am not in SA and terms, conditions, shipping costs, etc. may not be the same as it is in SA.

 

This particular buyer bid / won 6 items. As noted, SHIPPED SEPARATELY - NO COMBINED SHIPPING. It is far less expensive to ship parcels individually as part of a larger consignment than to combine into one larger parcel. UPS charges by 'billable weight': HxLxW of container as well as destination. Example: A 10-lb parcel, measuring 18 x 18 x 18", to SA, has a 'billable weight' of 42-lbs and a 23 x 17 x 17" parcel, weighing 30-lbs, has a 'billable weight' of 48-lbs. (scratches head) Each parcel is individually wrapped and addressed. My Forwarding Agent receives, completes the paperwork for shipping individually, so that I have a recorded delivery for each parcel, and posts SAPO or Courier-It. Any / All duties / taxes are paid.

 

This buyer, it would seem, did not READ BEFORE BIDDING and his / her email accused me of: "U are ripping off South Africans and should stay away". I sent him a screenshot showing UPS costs of shipping the six items directly to him and a screenshot showing costs to ship individually as part of a larger consignment. I then thanked him for considering the items I had listed, hoped he would find what he was looking for a little closer to home and advised him I would file a SNC for 'Terms Not Met'.

 

Buyer sent $1.00USD via PayPal as payment and sent email, "Only the bid is a contract, not any other part of your’e rediculios pricing is part of that contract. u r ripping people off. The price u see is the price u pay!!!!!!!!! MY BID WAS FOR 6 AT R1-00 EACH, TOTAL R6-00 AND THAT I PAID. SO EACTLY WHAT IS YOUR’E PROBLEM... They need too get rid of people like u."

 

I do believe I will send buyer an email directing him / her to this post. No 'name' has been mentioned, but I feel, somehow, I am 'talking behind his / her back' (something I would not like 'if the shoe were on the other foot')....and, maybe he / she will be more informed, after reading this, about contracts.

 

Thanks again.

Ruthie

Edited by Not1CentMore
Spelling

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qball

That is appalling from the buyer's side.

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lilythepink

Ruthie I am particularly "behind" with contract law in SA but the question has to be asked - would SA law or USA law govern the auction contract? Were it a shop in SA where an overseas tourist had bought something, then that tourist would have to sue the shop in SA.

 

You're not a shop but a person in the USA, selling on a SA site. So I can't help wondering which law would apply. (Hopefully the need will never arise for us to know absolutely, but it is an interesting question from my perspective).

 

Forum "family" - does anyone else have an opinion on this?

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Not1CentMore

Lily...

 

I am a 'dumb-dumb' when it comes to such stuff, but am 'thinking' that since BoB is a business entity within SA, and I have agreed to BoB's terms and conditions as a Seller, that I am 'bound' by the same rules, regulations and contractual laws as if I resided in SA. If I were needing to initate legal action against a buyer, for example, since the transaction took place in SA, I would have to proceed against the buyer in SA either personally (Small Claims) or through a collection agency that is licensed to collect in SA.

 

Then again, I am not the sharpest tool in the toolbox. It will be both interesting and informative to have a 'for real' answer.

 

Oh, by the by, I sent a email to the buyer with a link to this thread.

 

Ruthie

Edited by Not1CentMore

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Not1CentMore

Appeal Accepted?

 

Filed SNC for "Item Rejected" and Buyer appeals with, "Wining bid R6-00Paid $1 = More than R6-00Exactly what is this idiots problem?"

 

I copied/pasted link to this post for referral AND copied/pasted messages send via BoB's Message System AND pertinent parts of this buyers email (as above) and his appeal was accepted?

 

I just don't understand.

 

He bid.

He won.

He REFUSED to complete the transaction.

He REFUSED to comply with auction terms.

(Yes, he remitted R1.00 for each item and yes, I was credited for the sale, but LOST monies on PayPal fees, etc., and this 'counts'?)

 

AND....his perception that only the bid amount is 'contractual' and that he can ignore shipping, insurance, etc. was given a 'stamp of approval'.

 

IMO, this is soooooo wrong!

 

Ruthie

Edited by Not1CentMore

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EltoroTrading

Hi, the problem of people not honouring contracts is growing bigger and bigger on Bidorbuy. People even do "buy now" and then just not pay. At which stage can a seller decide that the price an auction reached was not high enough, and that the product would not be delivered? If the buyer is at least held responsible for the listing fee it would make things better, in which case crazy auctions should start at no less than R5.00.

 

People should also think twice before starting to insult people in ratings. I have recently opened a case of crimen injuria against a buyer calling me a thief and "cheap white trash".

Edited by EltoroTrading

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qball

Who is the buyer Ruthie? I would like to look into this.

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Not1CentMore

Thank-you.

 

I will send via PM. Even with all the 'hoopla', I do not want to embarrass him publicly.

 

Ruthie

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Not1CentMore

Update: SNC has been 'modified' to "Buyer At Fault". (Thank-you)

 

I am unable to rate Buyer...probably because first SNC was appealed, appeal accepted and therefore neither of us are able to rate the other. "Small potatoes" in the 'bag of spuds', but were I able to rate Buyer, it would be a (kind) negative: "Winning email notification sent. SNC filed. Appealed. Rejected. Re-listed".

 

Having said that, I can put a period at the end of this post.

 

Ruthie

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